Magracing under new management

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HeliumFrog
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by HeliumFrog » Mon 23. Oct 2017 11:31

Here is the progress of the new chassis. We have developed new electronics and gone some way in developing the new hardware.
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As you can see the chassis has rubber tyres (Currently shore 40) but the grip may be too much.
The steering is now fully servo controlled so this gives reduced shimmy and also much longer run times. It also gives full analog control so it is easier to drive back onto the track. (In fact it can be used as a full RC car!)
The chassis is adjustable. we have adjustable toe in on the test chassis, but this will probably be fixed on the production model.
The RC system will use Flysky protocol, so any flysky hand controller will work with them. There is a digital bind mode so in theory you can have an almost unlimited number of car channels. Flysky also do a hand controller which can switch between multiple models.
The electronics are arduino based, so it can be developed by third parties to add in features.

The problems we have encountered are as follows:-

The cost may be an issue. We are looking at about £60+ for a chassis at the moment with almost no profitfor us. The volumes are very low, so we cannot justify spending thousands on injection tooling. Wes did this but we suspect did not recover his costs.

We are also not happy with the front axles. We have narrowed the tyres as this gets the pivot closer to the outside of the wheel. We have done this so the wheel pivots as it does in a real car. This way any car can have scale wheel arches and not the large openings which would otherwise be necessary.

If you have any suggestions as to how we can improve the design, let us know.

Pal-Al
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by Pal-Al » Mon 23. Oct 2017 14:11

Hi ! I am pleasantly surprised that you are designing the type of RC car I have been trying to simulate for my dreams of tabletop racing ! Years ago while constructing a paved road course for 1/8 scale RC cars I soon realized that the speeds were way to fast and handling the cars properly was next to impossible ! I soon modified the battery packs by wiring the batteries in parallel thus cutting the output voltage to 3.6 volts approximately . This provided real racing speeds and improved driving skills a lot ! The racing then became realistic with a top scale speed of 200 mph and passing far more viable ! My go kart business had to close and therefore the park shut down, but the theory of proper scale speeds was proven correct . For years now I have been looking for a 1/32 RC car in which I could modify its speed however cutting the power also effected the radio. Correct me if I am wrong but your radio is operating at under 2 volts and scale speeds are a possibility ! You see most table top tracks could realistically fit on a football field 100 ft x 50 ft and of course the top speed of a full scale car would at most be 80 mph ! I could go on and on, but I hate typing ,however you are on to something here and it has the potential to be very successful !

Sincerely : Al

Pal-Al
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by Pal-Al » Mon 23. Oct 2017 14:21

Sorry , when I said 100' x 50' I really mean't yards ! Anyway good luck with your endeavors and remember speed is only relevant to the person your racing ! Whether you win at 50 mph or at 200 mph, its weather you win or not !

TX : AL

Ned
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by Ned » Mon 23. Oct 2017 17:33

Looks like you are making some good progress Martin. Just a little slower than we were hoping for.

Concerning price, I would be willing to pay about 80 US Dollars for a completely assembled, ready to run chassis without a body. Would pay about 1/2 that for a motor, electronics board, and servo with related frontend parts, assuming the front track was narrower.
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I like the motor, the size of the electronics board, and the servo controlled steering.

Some things to consider:
1. Use front and rear axle diameters that are commonly used in 1/32 slot cars, to make it easy to convert.
2. Include about 2-3 degrees of negative camber in the frontend.
3. Reduce the overall width of the chassis, (front and rear tracks and base frame). The original chassis was too wide for a 1/32 scale models of the typical race car of the 1960s & 70s and too wide for many cars today. Since your electronics are much smaller, you can easily make the chassis narrower. With your electronics board, the minimum width of the chassis is now limited by the length of the battery.
4. Reduce the overall height of the chassis where the battery is located. On balance, I think that most plastic components of the chassis are much thicker, heavier, and stronger than needed. Consider completely eliminating the top of the battery compartment and using brass strip instead of magnets to connect the battery to the electronics board. This will very significantly reduce the effective height and length of the battery compartment. (The downside of brass strip is the additional time it takes to solder wires to brass strip.) Design battery compartment, so when battery is installed, battery protrudes slightly below the base frame. Purpose of this is to reduce, as much as possible, the battery encroaching into the cockpit.

Eagerly awaiting more up dates.

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HeliumFrog
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by HeliumFrog » Mon 23. Oct 2017 20:45

Hello Gents

Sorry for the slow progress, but we are also doing buildings and this seems to have taken over a lot of our time at the moment. We are still not 100% we will do full chassis as its a lot of work putting them together and almost no margin to make a small profit. Anyone who has built up a slot car kit will know how long it takes. Great for a one off, but imagine doing large batches of them!

We will carry on working on the cars and if nothing else we will try to sell the radio boards, so Ned and others can still keep the hobby going.

The radio runs at 3.7v as the standard magracing cars. This gives good performance. It is important to prevent the battery being inserted the wrong way around. The new electronics do have reverse voltage protection, but the rechargables generate high current and it will blow the boards if not prevented. Wes' idea with the magnets works well which is why we want to use it.

I am going to stick with 2mm shaft wheels for a few reasons. Although this would be good it puts the part costs up through the roof, particularly for gears and bushes. The slot car industry seems to operate an unofficial "cartel" and gears for 3/32 are too expensive and only available in large quantities at a reasonable cost. 2mm gear is available easily.

The 2-3 degree camber may not be the best for the new chassis as the geometry is less prone to shimmy and operates slightly differently. Having said that I think Ned might not be too far away from the correct figure when we finally have it dialed in.

We do have some designs for a narrower chassis. Its a tight squeeze, but it is just about possible with the small servo at the front. As its offset its not as easy as it sounds to get it behind the knuckle assembly on one side and give a low profile bonnet (hood) line. I don't think we can get it in a mini cooper, but a car such as a VW Bug is possible (This is one we really want to do!). I also have a lexan bodyshell for a 1/24 mini cooper and this works well. It also doesn't look too bad on a 1/32 track.

As for an RC car I do have one running about and it is possible at 1/32, however I have done one in 1/24 and I think this would be the scale to go for as its more easily controllable and there is more room for standard RC gear for the home builder.

Pal-Al
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by Pal-Al » Mon 23. Oct 2017 22:02

I knew it was too good to be true, and I understand however a 1/32 rc car with the ability to run at scale speeds would definitely be the link that would open the doors to table top racing in the average household basement including town homes etc. Tamiya offered a car years ago however as per usual it was way to powerful and fast !

Good luck with your car and I do realize the cost of such an project as the cost of just an HO guide was $10,000 (HO Slide guide by my good friend & partner Ed Bianci ) Al

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Keld
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by Keld » Wed 25. Oct 2017 07:50

HeliumFrog wrote: As for an RC car I do have one running about and it is possible at 1/32, however I have done one in 1/24 and I think this would be the scale to go for as its more easily controllable and there is more room for standard RC gear for the home builder.

Originally I bought this magracing in the hope of making a 1/24 car, I did some progress but did not have the time, my dream was to have 15-20 1/24 cars on a 3-4 lane track with hills and more realistic landscape, Wes did a lot of this on his own track, and that turned the dream on.
I still have this dream, but it should be with standard 3 mm. stuff like in our slotcars, btw the new Revo slot cars in 1/32 is also using 3 mm axles, gears wheels, ball bearings, so that could go i 1/32 magracers as well, then there is a production line already and magracers could be sold as chassis and electronic only maybe.

Anyway I look forward to see your progress, Good luck with it.
/Keld

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Keld
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by Keld » Wed 25. Oct 2017 08:45

Martin did you think about lap counting sensors, how to count laps, and how to control jump starts etc. now the cars has power / versus slotcar where the track has power.
I am thinking about sensors in the track at the starting post to check if a car is jump starting.
/Keld

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MagRacer
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by MagRacer » Wed 25. Oct 2017 12:59

Hi Martin , nice car :-) I like that you are using Arduino and FlySky. Do you have a video of the car running?

kiklo
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Re: Magracing under new management

Post by kiklo » Thu 26. Oct 2017 19:20

Hi. Nice to see some good progress.

Can you elaborate on how the steering with the servo work. Is it free moving in neutral to follow the magline ??
Racing Regards

Kim K.

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