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PostPosted: Sun 24. Jun 2018 19:13 
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The easy availability of low cost 2.4g steering wheel transmitters, receivers, micro servos, etc certainly looks the way to go for Magracing but it is a definite squeeze to get standard items into a 1/32 car without removing cases, JST connectors, etc., and doing a fair amount of tricky hard wiring. This is not what most people want or indeed what most people are capable of.
I am now seriously looking at 1/24 scale. This is in fact only 33% larger than 1/32 so tracks would only need to be 33% longer pro rata but this extra space in the car would enable standard gear to be fitted into the cars with no modifications. It would also allow space for the CR123 battery which is pretty much available in your local high street. The cars could also possibly be marketed as free running r/c cars which would enlarge the market somewhat.
The attached pic is not 1/24 and has no real connection except that I am pleased with the 3d rear wheel and tyres made from a hard foam rubber which give just the right amount of grip and I am certainly thinking along these lines for a 1/24 car.


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PostPosted: Mon 25. Jun 2018 15:07 
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Hi Wes : A quick story : In the early 80,s I had a Go kart track facility which included a paved radio control road course and oval ! Because of the extreme speeds of our chosen Tamiya F1 cars I experimented with halving the voltage from 7.2 V to 3.6 V simply by wiring 2 sets of 3 - 1.2 V batteries in parallel ! This brought the top speeds down considerably ( 200 scale mph ) yet had no effect on radio control much to my surprise ! The popularity of this form of RC racing was immense as pro or rookie were able to control their cars and even hit their apexes well . I also rented cars for 15 minute periods with great financial success ! The club grew from 10 to 80 members in 2 weeks ! All was lost unfortunately when I had business problems too involved to explain here, however the RC experiment was proven very successful !
If you were to offer a 1/24 RC car RTR and having the same top speed as your Mag cars , the possibility of indoor table top RC racing would be a reality !
While I have your attention ! Could 1/8 steel braid not be used in Mag racing ? as I know I could then offer pre-fab track including straights, corners etc ! Just thinking out loud !

Al


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PostPosted: Tue 26. Jun 2018 11:51 
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Hello Wes
I really like the idea of 1/24 scale. I believe any car could be done in this scale with the magracing mechanisms.

I also think this scale is particularly suited to outdoor racing. One downside with outdoor tracks I can see is the potential to rust the guide wire. Nickel wire however doesn't rust and is slightly more magnetic and more ductile so is easier to lay. I am trying to find a source for this at the moment. The slightly larger cars would also cope better with any dust or debris. I am aslo expecting a slightly thicker wire and stronger magnet may be possible at this scale for optimum results.

Wes I'm glad to see the Radio boards are getting a work out!

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PostPosted: Tue 26. Jun 2018 18:29 
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Joined: Sun 13. Apr 2014 01:02
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Location: Sedona, AZ USA
Pal-Al wrote:
Could 1/8 steel braid not be used in Mag racing ? as I know I could then offer pre-fab track including straights, corners etc ! Just thinking out loud !


I suspect that 1/8" wide steel braid would work if:
1. the frontend of the car has a little toe in, a little negative camber, and the steering mechanism uses a servo with a magent on the servo arm. All three of these combined will completely eliminate frontend shimmy at any speed. I don't think that a car with the front wheels dancing left and tight will successfully follow a 1/8" wide braid and execute lane changes consitently. From my experience, a car with frontend shimmy won't work well with a 0.032" diameter wire.
2. The top of the braid is flush with the track surface +/- 0.005". Alternatively, tolerences something like +0.008" and -0.002" might work. Total absolute variation probably should not exceed 0.010".


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PostPosted: Tue 26. Jun 2018 19:48 
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Location: Sedona, AZ USA
HeliumFrog wrote:
One downside with outdoor tracks I can see is the potential to rust the guide wire. Nickel wire however doesn't rust and is slightly more magnetic and more ductile so is easier to lay... The slightly larger cars would also cope better with any dust or debris. I am aslo expecting a slightly thicker wire and stronger magnet may be possible at this scale for optimum results.

Most music wire has a rust inhibiting coating, but it is not rust proof. For my track which is outdoors, I use 0.032” diameter music wire manufactured by K&S Precision Metals in Chicago, IL, Stock # 501. (By the way, the cross sectional area of 0.032” wire is about 33% greater than the 0.028” wire used in most tracks. Interesting since the weight of a 1/24 scale car should be about 33% greater than a 1/32.)

After building a section of track that was exposed to dew and rain I discovered some rust. I tested some bare wire to see how likely it would rust. Pieces of wire continuously wet for weeks outside in a plastic pan of tap water did not rust, except at the ends and where ever the wire had been rubbed with sandpaper. The wire did not rust at the ends when it was heavily coated with a latex primer or elastomeric roof coating. The wire would however rust quickly anywhere it was coated with PVA glue (carpenter’s glue, Elmer’s glue, or similar). After some research I discovered that PVA glue is acidic and I quickly stopped using PVA glue. Ended up tearing out the first 30 ft of track!

Most of my track is 3 ½ years old. In some of that old part, there is visible evidence of rust. Some parts of the track are 1 to 1 ½ years old. There is no evidence of rust in any of that newer track. The reason may be partly due to age. But I think a lot of it is because of better construction techniques. In addition about 2 years ago I installed a canopy over the track that I use in the summer. It’s made of shade cloth. It screens out 50% of the light. That dramatically reduces the fluctuation of the temperature of the track surface and expansion and contraction of the track. This in turn reduces stress cracks of the roof coating and paint over the wire in the track. This helps to keep the wire dry but not necessarily the track dry. On a day like today, the temperature of the track surface would be too hot to hold your hand on without the benefit of the shade cloth. (It’s 100F (38C) with clear blue skies and 11% humidity; too hot to work outside.)


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PostPosted: Wed 27. Jun 2018 18:12 
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Joined: Thu 27. Dec 2012 14:59
Posts: 50
Location: Denmark
I also think that 1/24 scale is the way to go, this scale gives so much more opportunities with the extra space. In one car I had space for my Novak datalogger and brushed or brushless motors and ESC´s normally used in 1/14-1/16 scale cars.

A video of my 1/24 scale Mag Drag Racing cars. Left side: Brushed motor. Right side: Brushless.
I use 2,5mm track wire and it works really good on a drag strip, the cars almost never run off track.
The cars can also run on a road course.


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PostPosted: Sat 14. Jul 2018 14:11 
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Joined: Fri 28. Dec 2012 03:38
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WesR wrote:
Attachment:
DSCF0605.JPG
The easy availability of low cost 2.4g steering wheel transmitters, receivers, micro servos, etc certainly looks the way to go for Magracing but it is a definite squeeze to get standard items into a 1/32 car without removing cases, JST connectors, etc., and doing a fair amount of tricky hard wiring. This is not what most people want or indeed what most people are capable of.
I am now seriously looking at 1/24 scale. This is in fact only 33% larger than 1/32 so tracks would only need to be 33% longer pro rata but this extra space in the car would enable standard gear to be fitted into the cars with no modifications. It would also allow space for the CR123 battery which is pretty much available in your local high street. The cars could also possibly be marketed as free running r/c cars which would enlarge the market somewhat.
The attached pic is not 1/24 and has no real connection except that I am pleased with the 3d rear wheel and tyres made from a hard foam rubber which give just the right amount of grip and I am certainly thinking along these lines for a 1/24 car.



Great idea, Wes. I have been looking for an adjustable 1:24 chassis for mag steer vehicles on my 1:24 train layout. In another post I mentioned this company for excellent reciever/ESC combined boards: http://www.deltang.co.uk/



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PostPosted: Mon 23. Jul 2018 21:21 
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Joined: Thu 13. Dec 2012 19:06
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Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Nice to see that you are going to the right scale ;)

I always hoped that I could convert my 1/24 slotcars, so I will follow your progress.

But I read that there was no brake on the new board from Heliumsfrog, that is essential if driving 1/24 they are heavyer than 1/32

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PostPosted: Tue 24. Jul 2018 19:23 
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Posts: 307
Location: Sedona, AZ USA
Keld wrote:
I always hoped that I could convert my 1/24 slotcars, so I will follow your progress.

But I read that there was no brake on the new board from Heliumsfrog, that is essential if driving 1/24 they are heavyer than 1/32


Don’t worry about brakes Keld. A car built with a board sold by Magentice Racing (Heliumfrog) stops much faster than one built with the original board sold be Wes.

I have built and operated more than a dozen 1/32 scale mag steer cars. All are converted 1/32 slot cars. Most have rubber tires of some kind. The last 2 cars use 2.4ghz RC gear. They both have dynamic braking.

One is built with a DasMikro bidirectional ESC. That ESC has dynamic braking. But it is not automatically engaged when the trigger is moved to the neutral position. If the car is going forward, and the trigger is allowed to return to its neutral position, the car will coast. To engage the brakes you must deliberately move the tigger beyond the neutral position. To go in reverse, you must first allow the trigger to return to the neutral position again and then move the trigger in the opposite direction that is used to go forward. In this way, braking is optional.

Irrespective of the intended design of the combo board sold by Heliumfrog, a car built with that board acts like it has dynamic braking automatically engaged when the trigger is moved to the neutral position. This slows down the car very quickly. As I stated in an earlier post, I’d prefer a little less braking force for a 1/32 car, if the amount of braking is not optional or driver controlled.

Wes has also experienced excessive braking with a car he built using Martin’s board. In the case of a car with smooth plastic tires, like those on the original magracer, the rear axle locks up when the trigger is moved to the neutral position. The tires just skid, making if very difficult to control the car. My Ferrari 312 PB built from a Slot.it kit, has some kind of rubber tires (probably urethane). They provide very good traction and consequently the tires don’t skid, even though the car uses one of Martin’s boards. The car just stops very fast.

One of these days I expect to get around to designing a chassis with an adjustable wheelbase for a small 1/24 scale body. I will probably incorporate Martin’s board in the design.


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